What can we do?

[Coal's mom]

We have a one-year-old Border Collie that we got as a puppy. This is our second. The first died last New Year's Eve 2007. She was a 13-year-old couch potato, due to Addison's. This one is a hyper young male. We hired a trainer when he was 3 months old; had him neutered at 6 months. We had started out right-- taking his food away to avoid food agression, used commands to avoid teething us. His scratches my husband with his dew claws, but my husband's skin is more tender than mine.

He probably does not get enough exercise, but we do try to throw the ball or play with a water hose until he is exhausted a couple of times a day.

Everything was going along great until February. I stuck my hand into his crate (a normal occurence) and he snarled and snapped simutaneously, breaking the skin on my hand. It did not happen again for two weeks, and then to my husband, but has been escalating ever since. Luckily (?) he growls longer now, so we can usually get out of the way of his teeth. Keeping our hands perfectly still does not stop him. This week I moved my hands into my lap and he actually came up and snapped at them there. There seems to be no particular trigger. At times he does not like our hands near his face, but a few minutes before or later, he is sticking his nose under my hand when I call him and begging me to rub his nose!

We took him to the vet right after the first episode, but she could not find anything. The trainer was at a loss and has now suggested doggie tranquilizers.

Do not suggest we put the dog down. We are considering it as a last resort, so we do not need that as an option. My husband and son have unfortunately tried the "eye for an eye" approach by returning his biting with their smacks. I have been using what I hope is the Dog Whisperer approach of holding him down at his collar until the agression subsides. Border Collies have a longer concentration span than most children I have been around. Loud noises sometimes work, short term, but clapping my hands is NOT one of them.

Does anyone have a suggestion that we have not tried?

[MaggieDog]

Veterinary behaviorist NOW. Don't mess around with trainers or behaviorists with limited credentials, you need a professional that will keep everyone safe and help your dog at the same time using positive reinforcement methods instead of force.

An added benefit is that a vet behaviorist can prescribe meds if needed - one of my pet peeves is dog professionals who are not vet suggesting a specific med for a dog; regular vets may not be as schooled in behavior as we'd like, but at least they are better equipped than a trainer to know what might work pharmacologically. Meds like Acepromazine and other sedatives are not going to help solve your problem and could make it worse.

To locate a vet behaviorist, look at these two links; the initial consult will be pricey but it will be totally worth it in the long run.

American College of Veterinary Behaviorists: http://dacvb.org/about-us/diplomates/

American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior: http://www.avsabonline.org/avsabonline/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=79&Itemid=357

[joe]

I agree 100% you need to get some professional help, someone with knowledge of the Border Collie breed. And no one that uses the dog whisperer approach. It is my firm opinion that that approach with a Border collie causes more issues then it will ever resolve. Border collies responded to positive reinforcement training above all. Without knowing what kind of BC you have, fearful, aggressive, soft, stubborn, that approach can be dead wrong.
That being said I don't think there is near enough information for any one here to make any kind of realistic suggestion. Just a few questions to start with come to mind to start with. You hired a trainer, what kind of trainer? Was it Positive reinforcement training? Was it aversive training? Did you participate in the training? Is he in his crate voluntarily or is he there because you put him in? How long is he in? Why are you reaching into his crate? Are you pulling him out? Or taking food or a treat away? Or just trying to pet him? Beside running after a stream of water or playing ball does he get out? Get to walk? Does he get training or games that allow him to use his mind? Is he challenged to "think"? And I have a few more dozen questions running through my head.
Please stop the Caesar stuff for now. You may be making the situation worse.

[Samismom]

I agree with the previous posters. A professional consultation does seem to be warranted.

Something you can institute in the mean time is a "nothing in life is free" (NILIF) approach. Simply put the dog gets nothing (no food, no toys, no pets, no walks, etc) without working for it. If he needs to go out to do his business, have him sit or down before he goes out the door. Same when he comes back in. He can't go through a door or up or down stairs before or infront of you. When you feed him he needs to sit, or down, or wave, or whatever before he gets his food. Ideally you wouldn't even put the food bowl down. Just keep it and he would need to do something for each piece he gets. If you don't feel comfortable letting the dog eat from your hand it is okay to just drop the piece he has earned on the floor. Don't walk around or step over the dog if he is in your path. I just kind of shuffle my feet and keep moving foreward. That way the dog has to get up and move out of my way (which is what I want) and I don't have to worry about stepping on him. Also no getting on the furniture or sleeping on the bed. Even a couple of hours a day of umbilical cording might be of benefit. Put the leash around your waist and clip it to the dog's collar then go about your daily chores. Don't touch the leash unless necessary.

It is best if this is done by the whole family not just one person. The umbilical cording only has to be done by one person in a day. The next day someone else could do it.

[Coal's mom]

To answer the questions: We hired Barkbusters. They came out and showed us what to do and then left us to do it. Unfortunately, Coal does not always stop the bad behavior long enough for us to get the praise part out before he is back at it again. One of the Barkbusters tenets is that dogs have an attention span of about 10 seconds. Have they ever been around Borders? Both of mine have been more tenacious than a pitbull.

For 6 months, Coal has been living mostly on a 15 foot lead in the backyard during the day, but he is also loose in the yard when we are home. He has slept in a carrier in our room at night ever since we brought him home. He also has a crate (I call it a cage) in the room where I work. He has been in there mostly during bad weather or when I am working.I have been leaving him loose with me for a couple of weeks, first only in my space, but now anywhere that does not have a closable door. He usually stays on the floor near me.

He goes into his carrier and crate willingly most of the time, but not voluntarily except to get his toys out. The attack came when I reached in to pet him. I had done this every day since we got him at least to say good night, but other times, too, when he was crated. I have never taken anything away from him while he was in either one and have never had to pull him out. I cannot say goodnight anymore, he growls if I get within 2 feet of the carrier. I can reach in the crate and fill his water or food bowl without a problem, but then he will growl if I look at him from three feet away. Now it is happening everywhere. Today he was in my lap on the couch for an hour. Several times, without me changing anything I was doing, he suddenly tensed and started his bad boy act. Calling his name several times stopped it, but we are starting to think he has multiple personality disorder.

One of us throws a ball for him several times a day, either in the yard or down the stairs. I try to take us both out for a power walk, but have to use the Halti and have not managed to make it an everyday habit, yet. Summers in Houston are brutal. He is getting almost unmanageable on a regular leash.

Anyway, thank you for the suggestions. The vet behaviorist idea is a good one. The training ideas are good, too, things I should be doing, but have not been consistent with. I am also going to take him back to the vet to have then check for Lyme and thyroid problems per some of the other posts I read this weekend.

Wish us luck. Thanks.

[starfish]

Two things:

1) Don't tether your dog in the yard unattended. In many states, in fact, it is illegal to tether a dog. This could be a big part of the reason that he has developed this behavior. Not only can it cause behavioral problems, like aggression, it is dangerous for the dog. A tethered dog, especially a border collie, is going to go stir crazy with boredom and is likely to develop all kinds of undesireable behaviors. They can also become entangle in the tether. Instead of tethering your dog in the back yard when you are not home, you should crate him in your house (if he is not trusted out of a crate). Or, set up an x-pen somewhere in the house, so he can have more room to move around. Put a nice dog bed in there and give him some toys to play with. A Kong stuffed with treats or some other "interactive" toy is a great way to give him some mental stimulation during the day.

2) As was suggested before, a vet behaviorist is a must, IMO. From personal experience, I can tell you that a regular vet does not possess the knowledge to advise on behavior issues or to know what kinds of medicines might help your dog. A vet behaviorist will. A regular trainer, such as those with Barkbusters (a franchise business), will not have the knowledge necessary to help you. Plus, they are not going to be able to prescribe and meds, which you may very well need, at least initially.

Lastly, you will get plenty of advice from Internet forums, but when it comes to aggression problems, you are never going to solve the problem with online advise. You need a vet behaviorist who can evaluate your dog in person and provide you with a program (and possibly meds) to help get this behavior under control. I wish you luck and I hope you will come back on and give us updates on how he is doing.

[Coal's mom]

Just an update for anyone who is interested. Contrary to other posts, this forum offered the best help we could have gotten. We saw the vet again to rule out a physical problem (thryroid, etc.). When we mentioned a vet behaviorist, she was all for it. One of the two in this state was her professor in vet school and now a friend.

We saw the behaviourist that was only 30 miles away, since there are only two in the state. Apparently, our big strong aggressive puppy has fear issues, in addition to whatever else is going on. We have stopped all of the previous training techniques and are trying to use positive reinforcement with treats. He is already obeying the sit command without us even asking, if he thinks we have a treat in hand, and did a "lay down" on the second try. However, he only responds to his name or "Come" when he feels like it. Did I mention that he is too smart for his own good?

The good news is that he has only growled three or four times in the past two weeks, as opposed to three or four times an hour. He has bitten me three times in the past two days--twice while I was trying to "neutrally" get him out of the cat food, and once when I issued the down command without a treat in my hand. The last one may have been my fault--some of his food was on the floor below my hand. That still sounds like a lot of aggression, but he is using his "sheep bite", hard, but not enough to break the skin.

We were told not to pet him for two weeks. That is the hardest part of all this. People keep telling us that Borders are not cuddle puppies, but ours have both been. It is hard to body block him when he sticks his head on your knees and looks up with his "poor me" face.

At this point, we know we have a long way to go, and we still might not be able to stop the unacceptable behavior, but at least we are trying.

[MaggieDog]

Good on ya for finding a reliable professional!! Slow but sure wins the race when it comes to aggression and it sounds like you're on your way.

One thought: did your behaviorist mention anything about draglines in the house? This might eliminate the biting over situations like the cat food removal you described because it would allow you to move him without direct or close contact, thus keeping everyone below threshold and bite-free.

[Nellie's Dad]

It is great to hear that things are getting better. I agree, continue to be very consistent and things should continue to improve.

Good Luck and keep us updated please.

[Coal's mom]

Coal's Mom again.

It has been three months since my last post. Since then we have been seeing the behaviorist on a monthly basis.

Coal was not progressing very much, mainly because my husband and I could not be consistent in our training and were stingy with the treats. He was starting to get worse again. Three weeks ago we took him to a board and train facility. It is run by a woman who has worked with Border Collie Rescue in our area on their most difficult cases. She also has had award winning dogs in several sports and owns five Borders and three others of her own. She started specializing in Border Collies when she got a very difficult case and determined that most of the techniques of the time (10 years ago) did not work well with most of them. She still has that dog and takes here everywhere.

After 1 1/2 weeks, I was told that Coal needed much more exercise than we will ever be able to give him, but we could not find a new home for him that would meet his needs. The only choice we had was put him down or all be unfulfilled. It may sound strange to some, especially to my extended family, but I could not live with myself if I gave up on him. He is a beautiful loving part of my family and of course very intelligent when he is not growling and biting . He is also stubborn and smart enough to decide not to obey commands. The behaviorist told us we just had not practiced with him enough. Thankfully, the trainer knew what I did--Border Collies can be more like 2-year-old humans than dogs when it comes to obedience.

He will be in training for another week. We will start our training before he comes home. At this point, we need more training than he does.

Wish us luck and hope for the best.